Cara: Hello and welcome to a brand new episode of the Hormonal Mama podcast. I’m your host, Cara B., and today on the show I have Naomi Stonier. She is a relationship coach. And what’s really incredible is she herself went through infertility. So she is talking today about her experience with that and how she uses it in her relationship coaching. So you will want to stick around and listen to this one.
Cara: Hi, Niomi. Welcome to the show. I am psyched that you are here. So welcome. Thank you for being here.
Naomi: Thank you so much for having me.
Cara: Oh, it is such a pleasure. We have a lot of really exciting things to talk about today. And I’m excited to jump in and talk because I know obviously, we were just talking. I know this conversation is going to be exciting. We’re going to talk about so many great things. So let’s dive in. I would really like to talk about– there are two main things I really want to talk with you about today, and that is your coaching business and how your coaching business started. Now you’re a relationship coach, which is something so incredible and something that I feel like so many people need, & a lot of people don’t even know exists. So let’s start with that. Tell me a bit about your coaching, what you do as a relationship coach, and then tell me how it all started. I’d love to hear that.
Naomi: Yeah. Well, yeah, I’m a relationship coach, and my passion is helping people to create great relationships with all the important people in their life. So it’s not just about the intimate relationships. And I really have to spell that out because people always think when we talk relationships, they think just the intimate. But actually, it’s about all our relationships because when you have strong relationships with all the important people in your life, it really acts as a foundation. And from here, it gives us a lot of confidence to reach for our dreams. And of course, when I talk about this, people say, well, it’s not possible to have great relationships with everyone. What about those really tricky people in our lives? Because we all have those tricky people in our lives. And what I teach people to do is make a major shift in any relationship without the other person doing anything. Okay. Yeah. Because that’s my experience. Okay. So when we believe a relationship can’t change because of the other person, it’s very disempowering. And when we just believe we’re stuck, we have to settle or leave the relationship, end it. It’s very disempowering and it sneaks into every other area in your life. Show up in your work, in your friendships, in your parenting.
So this is the path I walked myself. So I had a dysfunctional family life. And when we don’t resolve these experiences with our family of origin, we take them forward. So I left school at 15 with no qualifications. I was friends with all the wrong people. I couldn’t hold down a job. And I did make some positive changes. Age 25, I got myself back into school and I got a degree. And I met the person who, thanks to relationship coaching, is still my partner today. Amazing. But another life event was coming my way, and that was infertility.
Cara: I can relate to that one. Let’s talk about that a little bit.
Naomi: Yeah. Well, so for me, my life blueprint, okay. That’s what I call it. But we all have one. We all have this life blueprint. And our level of happiness is determined by how close our actual life is to that blueprint. Okay. And so my blueprint was a big family. Okay. And so for me, a big family meant I’ll get lots of love. I’ll always be needed. And it was a way not to repeat my experience. And so I was lucky enough we were lucky enough to have a daughter by IVF. The first time it worked for us IVF.
Cara: Wow.
Naomi: But that blueprint was a big family. So bang straight onto the next one. And it never worked again for me. I tried nine times.
Cara: Nine times. Oh, my goodness.
Naomi: So I had ectopic pregnancies. I had operations, I tried donor eggs, and I went down a highly medicalized route. And I was relatively young. I was still in my– I was like 36-37 trying to have a second child, and it just never worked again. So I had different types of infertility. The third type of infertility was tubal. We managed to have our daughter, but I just fell down the rabbit hole of trying again and again, getting very sick in the process, you know, physically, emotionally, financially. It really nearly broke us. But as we talked about before we started recording, it became my gift because not getting that big family forced me to take a look at how I was meeting my needs, how I was showing up in my relationship. And I discovered relationship coaching.
Cara: How amazing is that? Yeah. I think it is so amazing to go through all that you went through. And I can understand infertility gosh, I had nine IUIs. I had a failed IVF. I had medicated cycles that failed. It was like one hit after the next. And it’s very difficult to pick yourself back up. Yet at the same time, you get trapped in the cycle of trying again and trying again and trying again and trying again. And you can’t stop. It’s almost like an addiction.
Naomi: It’s a way of coping, isn’t it? The way you cope is to start planning the next cycle.
Cara: Yes, exactly.
Naomi: And so that we go to doing instead of sitting in experience, we go to planning the next one. And as long as we’re planning it, we’ve got hope. And this is a big money-making industry, a lot of money. We’re dealing with very small percentages, very small chances. And in my case, it was unexplained infertility. It had a child. And I think for so many it is unexplained, isn’t it? Because there’s so much we don’t know about conception.
Cara: Yes. I don’t know why this just popped into my head. It’s something that just popped into my head when you were saying that you had a child and then everything you tried after that wouldn’t work. And there’s something that stuck in my mind for so many years since before I was pregnant, when I was really struggling and I could not deal with my emotions on my own. I was so overwhelmed. I was depressed. I was having trouble functioning every day. And I started seeing a therapist to help me get through it. And I said I was diagnosed with unexplained infertility. And she said something to me that I still think about every single day. And it was that, for lack of a better word, comparison of unexplained infertility and secondary infertility and how they are so much more similar than you think. And I think about it all the time because I can’t imagine what it must feel like to have your child. And then nothing works after that. No matter how hard you try, everything you try. How come I was able to have this child and it was great. And then all of a sudden I can’t. And it’s interesting because you said that you had your daughter through IVF.
Naomi: Right.
Cara: So first– you said it was tubal related.
Naomi: Right.
Cara: Or tube related.
Naomi: Right.
Cara: So it’s an interesting experience that you have to have these two different types of infertility affect you.
Naomi: Yeah.
Cara: And that’s hard. But my point with all of this is how you’re in this really unique position because you know what it’s like on both sides.
Naomi: But then also, I’ve had a child. I have to be really careful how I talk about it because I do have a child. Right. And I’ve been able to completely change the meaning of my experience that, oh, my God, I had this miracle. It turned out to be a miracle child at the time. It was like, oh, I need to have more, right? I’ve had one. Why can’t I have more? That was the meaning I was given. And life is about the meaning we give because the life experiences are going to come at you one way or another. We are all going to get hit, aren’t we? So for me, it was infertility. So the meaning I was given was I’ve had one. Why can’t I have more? Being able to go on the journey to switch that to, oh, my God, I had this child. Thank God I’m a mom. I’ve had that experience. And being in that reaction of not being able to slow down and assess and think and just being in reaction of going to the next cycle, the next cycle is just the worst place to be.
Cara: Yes, yes. All I can even say because it is it’s hard. It’s so– I can’t even think of the words. My brain is just like (garbled frustration).
Naomi: Well, you have a doctor telling you, oh, yeah, you can try again.
Cara: Right? Exactly. And it’s really tough when you have that in your ear. Okay, well, I’ll just keep trying. And I know for me, after my 13th fertility treatment cycle, I was like, “All right, well, I think it’s in my best interest to start preparing for moving on.” And I did not want to do that. And the thought of it was gut-wrenching. But that’s actually, I believe wholeheartedly that changing that mindset, if you will, and shifting to, “Okay, I’m going to move on.” is why I got pregnant, because it was only a few weeks later.
Naomi: Wow.
Cara: I know, it’s crazy. And then the other thought I have here is just there was a time I want to say this was after our failed IVF, and we were going to go do another IUI because we couldn’t afford another IVF cycle at that point. And my husband convinced me we need to take a break. And we hadn’t yet taken a break. We took one break that was not by choice, and that was because I had a cyst on my ovary from, I guess, whatever it was, the previous cycle. And they were like, we can’t do an IUI or anything. That one was out of my control. But this particular time, we took a trip.
We went to San Francisco to visit my brother and sister-in-law or my brother-in-law and sister-in-law. And it was all because my husband said to me, “We need to do this. We need to take a break for our sanity.” And it’s just so incredibly hard to get to that point because it’s a cycle. It’s like, okay, we’re just going to keep going. Anyway. See? I told you.
Naomi: For me, it’s so part of the conversation, isn’t it? No one could have told me to take a break. I would not have listened to anyone. And that keeping going is avoiding the emotion. When I was able to actually just be in the emotion of it not working, because we’re resisting the pain of the emotions. We’re trying to avoid them. And when you learn to just be in your emotion and experience it, you’re then able to process it and move through it and then make decisions. But when you’re making decisions based on trying to avoid an emotion or feel a different emotion, you make terrible decisions.
Cara: So true. That’s such an accurate statement. And you don’t think about it when you’re in that moment because really, you think you’re making the best decisions. Because you don’t realize what you’re doing.
Naomi: Really what you’re doing is avoiding everything. And then just that your husband being able to be and you see, I would say, this is masculine and feminine energy. This is the way I work. Masculine energy is able– and this is why there is so many problems in relationships with infertility, because feminine energy feels and sees everything and is absorbing it all. So that’s why it’s so difficult for the woman. Of course, she is also going through it. Masculine energy takes the big things and makes them small and is able to just shut off and shut stuff out and let go, like, go to sport, go to their phones and just shut off. And we feel such incredible frustration that they do this and we say they’re shutting off. And we also– when I talk about masculine and feminine energy, there’s cultural conditioning there, and people get a little bit funny about it, but that’s a whole other conversation. This is masculine energy showing up with your husband saying, “we need to stop.”. Yeah, feminine energy is like, go now.
Cara: It’s another thing you don’t really think about, especially in the moment. I can’t tell you how many times he would say, like, “maybe we should take a break.” And I’d be like, no, we are not taking a break. What are you thinking? I mean, I really thought them on it, but wow, what an amazing insight that those energies really do come out and help us make good or bad decisions, depending, of course.
Naomi: Well, they’re both superpowers. They’re both really important. But obviously when they get too strong, the feminine energy will whizz out of control. Masculine energy will go to anger to shut down, or they’ll go to retreating away. And this is why we have so many problems in the infertility journey because of that. Because for the female, she’s going through it. She’s seeing feeling, she’s filling up with it, and then boom, she can explode a bit. Masculine energy just doesn’t know what the hell to do.
Cara: Right.
Naomi: We make it mean there’s something wrong with our relationships.
Cara: Wow. You know, I love that you are saying all this because I know I had a conversation not that long ago with a fellow Infertility Warrior, and we had a whole conversation about relationships and what inferdil– that’s not a word! Infertility. There we go. And what it does to so many relationships, and it just– it has an impact that I just don’t think people realize. People who well, actually, I was going to say people who haven’t dealt with it, but even people who are dealing with it or who have, they don’t realize the impact that infertility has for so many reasons. It’s not as simple as we’re struggling to get pregnant and we’re fighting a lot. Well, it’s way deeper than that. And unless you’re going through it, it’s hard to understand that. And I think people like you who have this first-hand experience, have this training and really understand the dynamic of a relationship. I know we talked before about how it’s not just those intimate relationships, it’s all of the relationships. And that’s a huge part.
Something that I’m thinking about here as we’re talking is when I went through my own journey, my closest friends, none of them dealt with infertility, and they were all incredible and supportive and loving and kind. My closest friends, my mother, my sister, people who I needed the support from. I was lucky they gave me the support. But they didn’t understand. They had trouble. And I get it now, looking back, they couldn’t understand what I was going through. They didn’t go through it themselves. It’s just such an interesting thing to think back about how I see so often, not just the partnership getting more tackled, if you will– all of it.
Naomi: Old friends, people getting so upset. And so I just love that you brought that up and I’ve sort of interrupted you. But I know that’s okay. Yeah, absolutely respond to that because it was absolutely my experience. I was so so so hurt and upset by other people’s reactions. And of course, because people who haven’t been through infertility don’t understand. But I was at the whim of other people’s reactions. And that’s because and this is what I now coach so much on, because it was my experience, the understanding that other people can’t create your emotions. So I would have experienced such huge emotional reactions to other people’s responses to me. And it was just exhausting. And you give away all your power when you do that. And so as a result, I didn’t talk about it. No one would know what I was going through. And that was also hugely– because I would be going through a cycle and I would be all over the place and people wouldn’t know why. And I would look, I imagine, pretty crazy.
And I would spin in resentment that they don’t understand what I’m going through. And this is how we create our experiences. And going on the journey to understand other people cannot create my emotions was one of the most empowering things I learned to do. Because when you take responsibility for your own experience, you gain the ability to choose how you want to think and feel and act regardless of what someone else is doing.
Cara: That’s powerful.
Naomi: And this showed up, you see, in my relationships with my family of origin. And so when I took control of those experiences I was having in those relationships and I stopped believing that this person was creating all this emotion for me. I was able to put in my boundaries. I was able to control how I interacted with this person. I was able to show up compassion for this person. And you drop the expectations of how they should behave and just accept who they were. And it’s just the most empowering experience you can have. And you then are able to protect yourself. And so those people who just don’t understand them in secondary infertility one of the most painful things someone can say to you is, oh well, you’ve already got one, because it completely dismisses your whole experience and being able to just take back my power and just say, well, it wasn’t a choice or to just understand with compassion they have no idea and they don’t understand. And they’re just trying to say something helpful means you don’t drain all that time and energy because it’s such a huge energy drain, allowing that person to –BOOM– create all this for you.
Cara: You know, I am so happy that you just said that because– for two reasons. Number one, when I first started my infertility journey, I was one of those people. I would never have said it to anyone because I’m not a jerk. But I would frequently think, like I had a friend who dealt with secondary infertility. She had a beautiful son and he’s amazing. But she was dealing with secondary infertility and recurring miscarriages. And I didn’t understand because I hadn’t gone through it and I couldn’t at that point understand she already has a child. Why is she so upset? And it’s crazy to me, after having gone through years of this nonsense and looking back, I think, “How could I have even ever thought that?” That’s number one, because I think it’s incredible, the things that we think, that we look back on later and think– or say and wonder “How could I even have? I mean… how? Nnow, after going through it all, spending years in infertility hearing so many different stories. By the time I finally got pregnant, I had nothing but sympathy for any woman who dealt with any type of infertility, regardless, primary, secondary, unexplained, PCOs endometrios, or whatever, you know what I mean? Whatever it was.
The other part of that that I want to comment on is my own experience for a second, because I had an interesting experience. It was very early on again in my journey. We had only been trying for about a year, almost a year, and I was over 35 at the time. So it had already been like time to see a specialist. And the story is really about the… insensitivity of other people and my inability to separate what they’re saying. Like, you were talking about. Not giving what they’re saying the power, because– I wrote it down. I’m taking a lot of notes here while we’re talking. I don’t I know if you saw me taking notes, you probably did. Yes. You said other people can’t create your emotions. And that really stuck in my brain because I had this experience. It’s a long story, so I’ll abbreviate. But I had this experience early on in a group of other professionals. And at the time I was specializing in prenatal massage, before I ever started going through infertility.
And I was in this group of other pregnancy wellness professionals and it was like a networking meeting type of thing. It’s more involved than that. But that’s irrelevant. And we were all having little conversations here and there. I was the only woman in this group of like, I guess there are about 20 of us as the only woman who didn’t have children. And I never really thought of that as being a big deal except that night, every time someone would come over and say, “Oh, do you have any kids?” And I’d be like, “No”, they would feel awkward and I could see it. They didn’t know what to do or how to talk to me. I’m like, I’m still a person. I’m still a woman. What? But it got even weirder. Any time I would mention my struggle to conceive and every response was something along the lines of, “Oh, well, I conceived really easily.” Or, “Oh, I had my first kid when I wasn’t even trying to get pregnant.” Or something ridiculous. And so many things. And to make an even longer story short, the next morning I had a freak accident, fell down the stairs and destroyed my shoulder and lost a year of work.
And that’s important because– again, that’s a story for another day. But I spent months blaming my accident– because after that I had to leave that networking event early. After all these different comments, I was hysterical. I couldn’t breathe. It was the lowest I’ve ever been in my life, I think that night. And when I woke– I cried myself to sleep, woke up in the morning, I could hardly see. And for months, when I say month, it’s probably way more than months, at least six months. I blamed my fall on the women at the party because of the things that they were saying rather than saying, “Okay, they can’t relate. That’s not my problem. My problem is what I’m dealing with.” And so I think it’s really important. I mean, I’m like, I just keep going back to what you said, “Other people can’t create your emotions”.
Naomi: To understand the consequences of the time and energy drain. You fully understand you’re taking in the time and the energy drain. But when we feel uncertain, we go to anger to get certainty. So the fear and the uncertainty you felt in those encounters, we go to anger to resentment, bitterness, blame to get that certainty back. The pain you were in with your shoulder, you’re burning with that anger is to get the certainty and taking in the time and the energy drain of that is enormous. And for me, it was so profound. I lived in exhaustion, nervous exhaustion, because I was just giving away my power in every situation. And I was on the emotional roller coaster having exactly those kinds of experiences. And when someone makes this comment, it is like a dagger to the heart. It is, boom. It’s a body blow.
And what I do is, I help people to understand that body blow won’t go away. We are human. Life is– we live in 50-50. The human nervous system shifts through the lower emotions, the lower vibration emotions to the higher vibration emotions. It’s 50-50. Your body will just shift through these emotions through the course of a day. It’s about whether that body blow lasts five minutes or five months.
Cara: Right.
Naomi: Can you still remember a moment five years later and boom– feel the body blow again. Do you want to have that reverberating through your body? And it’s about having the tools and techniques. So when that comment gets made, go, “Oh, okay. I flooded with the emotions. The feelings flooded through my body. My focus has gone to the belief, and my language is ‘Who do they think they are?’” There’s a pattern that will run that we can nip in the bud and that we can just go, “Oh, okay. That pattern has been triggered. Breathe through it, drop back into my body, distract my brain, and we can just get back into perspective and wisdom and empathy and compassion.” They don’t understand. It is not personal. And we can move to all of that language and that belief. To shift our body out of that pattern.
Cara: Love it. That is one of the most important aspects of this whole thing. And I think most of us who have gone through or are going through this, don’t even realize that. And that’s so important.
Naomi: Yeah. I mean, you think about the time and the energy drain if you were able to nip that pattern in the bud when that trigger happens, because we all know the dangerous places when we’re in infertility. For me, it was, first of all, just going through infertility. But then this stuff is unexpected. The next round of kids, everyone started having their second kid, and it was just devastating. I have a friend who’s in her 70s, she was experiencing the Reverb of infertility when everyone started having their grandkids. This stuff reverberates for our lives. And do you want to keep that– when you’re going through the infertility journey, you need to keep that time and energy for what’s important. We do not want to be draining it to these moments. We want to keep that time and energy to ourselves. That was one of the– obviously, I’ve got no medical proof for this, but I just can’t help feeling that one of the reasons that I didn’t conceive again was because I was just exhausted emotionally, physically… and I was just on the emotional roller coaster just spinning because this stuff shows up everywhere. And so for me, it took infertility to step off the roller coaster. That was the life lesson. Now, obviously, with the blessing of one child, I would take what I know now over another child any day.
Cara: Yeah, yeah.
Naomi: So I’m just so grateful. I’m a great parent to one kid, and I have emotional freedom, which is just transformational. I would take that to five kids any day.
Cara: I just love what you’re saying because I can relate. Before having my kids, I wanted four kids. My husband was not on board with that, but I wanted four kids. No, he was like, “Maybe one, maybe two. I’m good with that.” And I was like, “I want four kids, we’re having four kids!” I mean, you want what you want, but what you’re saying is exactly how I feel now I have my twins. And even if I hadn’t had twins and I had one beautiful, amazing child, I would have said, this child deserves all of my energy and love, and that’s what I can give. I struggle with two kids. It’s very hard.
Naomi: Well twins, it’s a little bit different.
Cara: It’s a crazy life. But it’s that realization that I don’t want to have more kids. Even though, yes, in my dream universe, I wouldn’t have struggled to get pregnant. I would have had my four kids. But maybe that wouldn’t have been perfect. I feel right now my family is complete and wonderful, and I’m the best mother I can be to my twins. And if I had more children, if I had those four, I don’t think I’d be sane… just knowing me. Some people can handle 4, 8, 12, 15 kids. I can’t. I can barely handle two!
Naomi: It’s about why you’re having them. Lots of us are having kids to meet our own needs, and that is not good parenting. And so for me, I was expecting those children to meet my needs, to love me, to make me feel important, significant and needed. Because of the experiences that I’d had and the way I was meeting my needs. I was expecting everybody around me to meet my needs. And that puts a lot of pressure on our relationships. So, now I know how to meet my own needs. I take 100% responsibility for my own experience. And as a result, I have much better quality relationships. I probably would have gone on to have bad relationships with those children because I would have been expecting them to meet my needs, as was done to me.
Cara: Oh, it’s so powerful.
Naomi: We have to get really honest, and it’s very uncomfortable stuff to talk about. We have to be really honest. It’s not comfortable for me to admit that I would have done that to a kid.
Cara: Yeah. But, you know it. ‘Cause you know yourself.
Naomi: I’m honest about it to help others. So they don’t make the same mistake.
Cara: I love that. I respect that.
Naomi: Yeah. The other one to be really honest about is when we’re trying again and again and again… we really need to check in with that, because when we’re having these multiple tries and we don’t stop, as you will know, we have to check in with why that is.
Cara: Yes. You’re 100% right, man. You are a very brilliant woman, Naomi.
Naomi: Thank you very much. Thank you. Right back at you!
Cara: Thank you. You’re very aware. You’re self-aware, which helps you to be more aware of others around you. And that’s something I think a lot of us struggle with. Infertility or not, it is very hard to take responsibility for your own emotions. I know. I know better than a lot of people. I know how hard that is. But it is so empowering when you finally can. I’m just going to keep saying “Other people can’t create your emotions.” I told you, I wrote it down!
Naomi: It’s a game-changer, isn’t it? And this isn’t to say that I get it 100% right. I repeatedly slip into blame and to frustration and impatience. But it’s just about how many times are you willing to fall off the path and get back on again? It’s a lifelong journey of I will show up in my relationships in a way I’m not proud of. I’m not a perfect person.
Cara: Who is?
Naomi: Yeah, exactly. It’s just that ability to go, “Oh, yeah. It really wasn’t cool the way I just behaved then, was it?” And be able to just… it’s the difference between that five-minute moment and something that spirals into a week where we’re questioning the whole relationship.
Cara: Yes. Oh, my gosh!
Naomi: And when we behave in a suffering state, when we don’t behave in an elegant state, it’s uncomfortable. So we go to blame and judgment to justify our behavior. Exactly. And the holding is a massive time and energy drain.
Cara: It sure is! Yeah, it sure is. It’s– there’s a word in my head… it just came into my head and went right out. And I can’t think of it right now for some reason– projecting. That’s what it was. The word projecting.
Naomi: Yes! Of course! That’s the word! The buzz word at the moment.
Cara: It is. But it’s incredible how we don’t even like– I can’t tell you how often I snap at my husband. And later I think to myself, what did he even say that made me snap? Probably nothing. It was probably something like, “Hey, could you pick this up?” It’s the only thing I can think of because I’m not a neat and tidy person. I’m a slob. But it’s crazy how you don’t think about it in the moment. And then when you go back and think later and you’re like, “No, wait a minute. What triggered that?” And so often, at least for me, the trigger really is inside of myself. And I’m not taking responsibility for whatever it was. You know what I mean?
Naomi: If you give me permission to challenge that…
Cara: Please!
Naomi: Because that question “Hmmm, what was going on there?”, that’s a question that will set you free. Ask the right question. That will set you free. Ask the wrong question, and you’ll stay stuck. And when we go, “Yeah, what’s going on here? Yeah, that was out of proportion to the moment.” That gets you into curiosity, and then you can discover what’s really going on underneath. So that’s a way of taking responsibility.
Cara: I love it. Oh, I think that is so great. All right, Naomi, let’s switch gears here for a minute. Yeah. I want to ask you some of my “Let’s get to know you questions.” These are my questions I like to ask all of my guests. And they’re fun. They’re really an interesting way to– well, for me to get to know you, for audience to get to know you. But I think in a lot of ways, it’s a fun way for you to get to know yourself. So I’m going to start with what I think is my easier one. I don’t know. Not everybody agrees. And that is who are three people who have been the most influential or inspirational to you in your life. Now, this doesn’t have to be related to business. It can be. It can be personal, it can be creative, inspiration, whatever it is. Three people who have had the most influence or inspiration on you.
Naomi: Well, I’ll give you both because I like it. Let’s do it. Obviously, personally, it would be my husband, my mom, and my daughter, without a shadow of a doubt. And then professionally, it would be Oprah, she’s my hero. Maya Angelou is another incredible one. And Michelle Obama.
Cara: I mean, how can you not love these three are amazing women. I particularly love Michelle Obama. She’s like, my hero. In awe is the perfect word. I see her, I hear her, and I stop in my tracks and like, “What she’s saying? I must hear what she’s talking about.” Whatever it is.
Naomi: Have you heard her podcast?
Cara: I haven’t. I don’t have time. I need to find time in my life.
Naomi: You’ve got to listen to her talk with her brother, talk with her mom. They are just– there’s no perfection. There’s, like, just open… Ahhh, it’s just the best stuff.
Cara: I love that. I think that’s super cool. And I’m sure I would listen and be like, “Yes, tell me more, tell me more.” And then when the episode is over, I’d be like, “Why is it over? Why are they done talking?” She’s just such an incredible person. I mean, everyone you mentioned, Oprah, Maya Angelou. I mean, come on. But Michelle Obama, I just want to hug her. I want to hug her all the time. I feel like she’s the type of person if I’m having a tough day, I feel like she would be… I don’t know. Obviously, I’ve never met Michelle Obama, but I feel like she’d be the kind of person who would embrace you and you suddenly would feel like, “Oh, well, everything’s better. Okay.” I almost feel like she wouldn’t even need to say anything. And whatever I’m upset about would just melt away because she hugged me. Yeah, I don’t know.
Naomi: She’s just very normal, which is pretty incredible. I love Oprah because she’s just– I’ve been on this journey. I’m a loud woman, and I spent years trying to tone it down, and I gave that up. Thank God I gave that up. It can be difficult. It can be often not socially acceptable for women to be loud. And Oprah’s one of these people who will just interrupt you. She will just chat– She was interviewing Tina Turner, and Tina said, “I’m going to tell you if just let me.” I just love that. That someone who is at the top of her game is being told, “Can you stop talking so that I can tell you.?”
Cara: I think that is so awesome because I’m like you. I’m very loud. I’m told all the time that everyone I know, “I’m right here, and I can hear you.” It’s either because I’m so excited or whatever. But I’m just a loud, excitable, energetic person. And I can’t tell you how many times my dad says that to me.
Naomi: And a lot of times you feel a lot feel shame about it, don’t you?
Cara: Yup.
Naomi: I’ve had a lot of shame about being loud and lively and sometimes, frankly, hyper.
Cara: Oh, yeah. Most of the time in my case. It’s so crazy to me how often throughout my life people will tell me, “Okay, you’re kind of loud tone it down.” Yes, the shush thing or like. And a lot of the time I would just go, (whispers) “Okay.” And then I won’t say anything.
Naomi: And then go away and really worry about it. But I just got to this point, and it’s the great thing about getting into forties. I’m just okay with being loud.
Cara: You’re just like, “I am who I am.” I’m just so glad you’re saying this, because that’s the point I’m at in my life. I’m in my early 40s and I’m kind of like, “You know what I am me. I’m tired of trying to not be me. I like who I am. I’m weird. I’m quirky, I’m loud. I’m a little odd.”
Naomi: The unintended consequences of that is you do calm down because a lot of the loudness can come from insecurity. When I would get nervous– my friend and my best friend is so funny. She will go quiet. Loads of social anxiety between us. My social anxiety manifested in getting far too loud and chatty.
Cara: Yes!
Naomi: She’ll just go silent. And I was like, “I wish I was like you yandou went silent.” She’d be like, “I wish I was like you and went loud.”
Cara: I have to tell you why that’s so funny to me, because my best friend and I are the exact same way. And I laugh because we’re cousins, right? So her dad and my mom are brother and sister, and we’re a year apart, so we’re very close in age. We’ve always been close our whole lives, but that’s exactly how we are. I get loud, she gets quieter. And for Halloween, one year, we dressed up, I was the devil, she was an angel. And another year for Halloween, she was Audrey Hepburn, and I was Marilyn Monroe. And the whole idea was our costumes really reflected our personalities in the way that people perceive us.. Right. It’s so funny. I just love that. I think that’s awesome.
Okay, so here’s the other question for you. This one is really fun. I really like this one. It’s a little bit difficult sometimes for people to answer. So I always give it second or I try to. And that is this: If you could have your dream dinner party or if you don’t like dinner parties, you can have your dream brunch or it doesn’t even have to be food. I just like food. So I talk about food a lot. Walk on the beach, walk in the park, whatever it is, your dream gathering with three people. Now, here’s the important part. This is where I make it way harder. These three people can be dead or alive, fictional or real. They can be people you know, they don’t have to be people you know. And to make it even harder for you, they don’t have to be people. They don’t have to be real. I had someone talk about spirits. They could be anything.
Naomi: The shamanic energies? Fire? Air? Water?
Cara: Sure! They can be anything. When I had my dream dinner party, I asked myself this question. I invited a dragonfly to my dinner party. And I mean, I’ve had people invite characters from books or cartoons or Muppets. I mean, whatever. I like to make it really difficult, but it also makes it more fun.
Naomi: Yeah. I think I would invite both of my grandmothers. Both passed when I was young. I would love to get to know them more. I would love to have had the opportunity to find out about their lives.
Cara: I love that.
Naomi: That would be amazing.
Cara: That’s super cool.
Naomi: Both grandparents– grandmothers on both sides. My mom and my dad’s side. They would be really interesting to chat to.
Cara: Yeah. And that’s cool. I can relate to that because one on my list is my great grandfather, who I never met. He died when my mom was ten. And he was a Holocaust survivor. And that’s just part of his story. I’m a lot like him from what my grandmother always told me and my mom, apparently, I would have just loved him because we’re so much alike. But I can relate to that. So that’s cool. So grandmother and grandmother and would there be a third or just those two? It’s okay if there’s just the two of them. It doesn’t have to be a third.
Naomi: Yeah, I think it would just be the two of them.
Cara: I love it. What a nice dinner party. And I like it because I can relate to it. And I think that’s really lovely. Awesome. Well, Naomi, I have one last question. It’s a really simple one. Where can our listeners connect with you? Where can they connect with you? Learn about you, learn about what you do and everything.
Naomi: I am on Facebook. Just check me out. Naomi Stonier. I’ve got so much content on there. I do a masterclass every month. I’m plumocoaching.com, so you can find out about me there. I do a free session for people, which is going to give you a great idea of what relationship coaching is and what it can do for you. I mean, I do so much in that session. I do these really simple exercises to help you understand where you’re at now, why what you’ve already tried isn’t working, which clears up the brain space, gives you a lot of clarity. And from there, we make a plan of what it is you need to do to get where you want to go. And I do all of that in one session, so you can reach out to me on Facebook or plumocoaching.com and book a session with me. I would just love to hear from anyone. If what I’m talking about is resonating, please reach out.
Cara: I love it. Everything you’re talking about resonates with me. And I think that is just amazing. And I’m just so excited.
Naomi: I’ve had so much fun chatting with you, Cara.
Cara: I’m so glad! I want to thank you for being here. I know we’re– what are we, 5 hours apart here? So it is your evening. So you can go have your evening now. But seriously, thank you so much, Naomi. This was just amazing. I enjoyed this more than I can even say. So thank you so much for being here today.
Naomi: My pleasure.
